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Amsterdam, DAaM 18 th June 2010. Final summary. Ian Bird. Potential Demonstrators. Bockelman xrootd demonstrator (with filesystems ): should collab with IT-DSS xrootd ideas ? Massimo: Stewart : +DIRAC Panda dynamic data placement?

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final summary
Amsterdam, DAaM

18thJune 2010

Final summary

Ian Bird

potential demonstrators
Potential Demonstrators
  • Bockelman
    • xrootd demonstrator (with filesystems): should collab with IT-DSS xrootd ideas?
  • Massimo:
  • Stewart: +DIRAC
    • Panda dynamic data placement?
  • CHIRP (== afs-like fs) – similar to xrootd proposals?
  • Behrman:
    • ARC caching – general use?
  • Baud/McCance:
    • Use MSG as weak coupling to address data consistency (storage, catalogues, apps)? Or as DM info system?
  • CMS catalogues – Simon Metson
  • Catalogues: Oscar
    • DHT, Bloom filters, MQ, Alien FC ???
  • Pablo: LFC vsAlienFC

Ian.Bird@cern.ch

slide3

Jeff:

    • CoralCDN
  • Dirk/Rene: proxy caches
  • NFS j-p/gerd
  • File access - jens

Ian.Bird@cern.ch

slide4
And...
  • Need network planning group (David F.)

Ian.Bird@cern.ch

discussion items
Discussion items
  • Data transfer...
    • Many suggestions – both here and in contributed docs
    • Not all coherent...
    • Probably need a group to address this:
      • Can “FTS” + suggestions/fix do what is needed
      • Do we need an (other) asynchronous data transfer mechanism (job finishes, here is output, deliver it to archive)
  • SRM:
    • Is it dead?
      • Separate archives from caches – archive interface is simpler (subset of SRM?); cache interface is fs (-like)
      • Not dead but only use limited pieces

Ian.Bird@cern.ch

discussion items1
Discussion items
  • Access protocol
    • Can we have a data access common protocol?
    • Is it xrootd?
  • What is it we are trying to optimise?
    • Not CPU! But this is what (all) we measure today...
    • Should better specify metrics for success
  • Monitoring now
    • We need to measure what we are doing so that we have something to compare with!
    • Real information from MSS and other data management components is missing. We need it now.

Ian.Bird@cern.ch

slide7
And ...
  • Can we have a simulation ??
  • What are the metrics??
  • Security issues
    • WN access to WAN
    • Policies
  • Demonstrators
    • Follow up in GDBs

Ian.Bird@cern.ch

my personal summary
My personal summary
  • Storage:
    • Separate archive (tape) and cache systems
    • Simplifies interfaces to both
    • Allows industrial (standard) solutions for archives
    • Never read tapes
  • Data Access layer
    • Need combination of data placement and caching
    • Effective caches can reduce (or optimise existing) space usage (separate tools from policies)
      • Several potential caching mechanisms
    • Can’t assume that jobs find all of the files needed at a site – get 90% remote access (cache) the rest
    • Can’t assume that catalogues are fully up to date
    • Model of access is filesystem (-like)

Ian.Bird@cern.ch

summary 2
Summary -2
  • Data transfers
    • Need a reliable way to move data from a job to an archive (or point to point)
    • Need data placement mechanism
    • Need transport for caching
    • Need remote access mechanism
  • Namespaces, catalogues, authz, quotas etc.
    • Want dynamic catalogues that reflect changing contents of storage
      • Could be LFC + MQ, DHT, Bloom filters, Alien FC (?)
    • Computing models should recognise that information is best guess (not 100% reliable)
  • Grid-wide home directory
    • Is needed
    • Technologies? How to do this?

Ian.Bird@cern.ch